Thoughts on an FR-S, a few days in

"Jayhawk Jake" (jayhawkjake)
03/25/2019 at 22:15 • Filed to: None

In case you somehow missed it , I traded my Camero in for a Scion FR-S last Thursday. Since then I’ve put about 350 miles on it, which is enough for a quick oppo review

First of all, let’s clear the air. As many people seem shocked and/or appalled: yes, this really happened. The Mustang is gone, the Scion is here. I just had the title inspected this morning, I didn’t rent or borrow the car.

So why get rid of a 435 horsepower Mustang GT and replace it with a 200 HP torque-less car for the youths?

After last year’s sports car season wrapped up, I started thinking about this season. Having just purchased a house and begun planning a wedding in earnest, I was genuinely concerned about the running costs approaching. I had to replace the Mustang’s all season tires for a not-insignificant cost and I knew from experience that I was staring down a ~$1400 tire bill at the start of the year for autox and track days. My initial plan was to eat that cost and just drive less - do maybe 5 or 6 events instead of 10, one or two trackdays, and call it a year.

As I gave more thought to that plan I began to feel uneasy. Was it really worth giving up all that fun just to save a few bucks? What would my spring, summer, and fall look like if I didn’t participate in these sports? How would I feel at the end of the year with worn out tires and weekends spent at home doing nothing? I decided that wasn’t truly what my heart wanted. I wanted to get out and drive. So I turned my sights to a car that seemed like a promising surrogate for the Mustang: half the power, but less weight, still rear wheel drive, still attractive, selling for about what my Mustang was worth and equipped with tires that cost just over $500 a set.

That car was the Scion FR-S.

I found one in town to test drive about 2 months ago. Going into the test drive I was concerned that my dreams of a cheap season would be crushed behind the weight of the oft derided torque dip. But I came away impressed: these cars are an absolute riot to drive.

The thing about power, I’ve learned, is it’s relative. Yes, 435 HP from a roaring V8 is thrilling and I will absolutely miss the noise and thrust, but I don’t need it to have fun. I recall shopping for my first Mustang, a 2015 Ecoboost, and test driving a BRZ at the time. My goal that year was to get something with real power, so the BRZ was a huge let down. But now that I’ve had real power I didn’t feel burdened by the desire for it. I was able to let the FR-S speak to its strengths.

Nimble, light, sharp - all words that describe driving the FR-S. On center the steering actually feels very similar to the Mustang’s electronic power steering in “sport” mode with one very important difference: as you move even a hair away from center something very strange happens. The car turns . And thanks to its small stature, it can actually slalom and wander in a standard traffic lane a surprising amount.

That quick and direct steering made itself abundantly apparent on the autocross course this weekend. This is easily the most controllable car I have ever driven. Maybe it’s the honeymoon period talking, but I was downright stunned by how easy it was to control when the tires broke loose.

In fact, I can already tell this car has much to teach me. Take the balance between oversteer and understeer, for example. I know, logically, that to correct understeer with a RWD car one should simply add power to get the car to rotate. I tell this to novices on guided coursewalks every event. In the Mustang obviously this is true, but as the front tire squeal for grip the slightest breath on throttle can put it into a wild drift. With the FR-S I entered a turn, felt the front getting away from me, added throttle and immediately the rear end stepped out the at the perfect angle to complete the element with a fast line.

Despite the terrible all season tires I was coping with, I managed consistent times and a 13th place finish in PAX. A far cry from my usual top 3 finish, but downright impressive for a car with a pair of weathered Prius tires on the front.

On the street the story is similar. Sure, my days of blasting to 120 MPH are gone, but the car is so engaging up to 60 it nearly makes up for it. The ride is certainly firm, but not uncomfortable. And the cabin, while spartan, is incredibly well laid out with many nice touches that I’ll share in a later post.

When we put aside our biases and assumptions we open ourselves the new experiences and opportunities. While I will always hold a special place in my heart for the S550 Mustang, and will likely purchase another one in the coming years, the FR-S is hear to stay and I cannot wait to see how far it can go.

DISCUSSION (31)

WRXforScience > Jayhawk Jake
03/25/2019 at 23:20

My BRZ still feels new to me after 4.5 years, 50k miles, 50+ trackdays, and over 100 autox events.

glemon > Jayhawk Jake
03/25/2019 at 23:31

Having a uto crossed many small, light, underpowered cars of my own, and having had the chance to drive a few beasts including a 500 hp Jaguar F Type, I totally understand what you are saying. I don’t have the skill, control, and reflexes to use the big power right (you might, I know I don’t) but using just a little oversteer to flick the tail out in a ti ght bend to complete the corner coming out pointed where you want to go is great fun.

Having owned a series of c ars, each faster than the one before, I also agree speed is relative (though I never had anything like 400 hp ), what feels intoxicatingly fast on the first test drive quickly becomes the new normal.

Enjoy the new ride.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 00:31

I think y ou’ve crossed a threshold of the experienced racer: buying track cars based on running costs (of consumables, especially), because you've learned that how fast you're going around the track isn't particularly related to how much fun you're having, but it is directly related to how much money you're spending to do it. Congrats on the FR-S!

Tristan > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 01:00

About all like can say is that the Toyobarus looked pretty impressive at yesterday’s autocross! I think you’ll have plenty of fun.

Josh - the lost soldier > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 02:20

I don’t think my opinion will matter all that much, since I spend more time in my FR-S on the road than on the track, but I’ve learned that, after owning several 400+ hp vehicles (supercharged B6 S4, LS3-swapped 240SX S13, and a race-prepped 944 Turbo) the FR-S is actually a nice back-to-basics car to drive. I’ve got a 2013 model with no LCD in the interior and driving it is always an occasion. It’s not as analog as a mid-60s British roadster or an NA Miata, but there is a real sense of jinba ittai every time I drive the car. I’m a bit of a broke bloke and the FR-S is my daily (for now...), but I always have some joy in just driving it around, even if it’ s for mundane errant running. It’s a great autocross and track car, but I’ve never had a car that’s as at home at an autocross as it is on a mountain road back home.

Congratulations on the new car! I hope you like it!

DutchieDC2R > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 02:50

I dont really get the post. You traded in your Camero, but later in the post youre talking about your Mustang...?

Anyways, thnx for the review. The BRZ/GT86 is one of the potential candidates for replacing the DC2 and this review genuinely helped me get some insight in the car.

Mike > DutchieDC2R
03/26/2019 at 05:31

Yeah.. I saw that got confused, stopped reading and came here for answers.. Typo, or bad writing.. Long article to read if it is nonsense

Speed > Josh - the lost soldier
03/26/2019 at 07:18

You taught me a new term. Jinb a ittai.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

Jinba ittai is a Japanese four-character compound describing unity of horse and rider which is pertinent to Yabusame, Japanese mounted archery.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > DutchieDC2R
03/26/2019 at 08:47

Kinja'd!!!

Long live the camero

Nibby > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 08:52

should’ve gotten a V6 mustang bro!

AdverseMartyr > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 09:19

But what plates did you get for it?

DutchieDC2R > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles
03/26/2019 at 09:26

CAMERO HABANERO!!

Jayhawk Jake > AdverseMartyr
03/26/2019 at 09:44

Still deciding. Since Carmax does all the paperwork and mails a plate, it’ll be a bit - I need to get the new standard plate then submit my custom plate request.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Nibby
03/26/2019 at 09:44

Yeah, but think of how many V6 mustangs you can get for the price of a V6 mustang.

Jayhawk Jake > Josh - the lost soldier
03/26/2019 at 09:45

That’s a good take, and honestly part of my enjoyment in the car so far. It’s refreshing to sit in something so simple after being coddled in the massive luxury of the Mustang.

Looks like I’ll be making another trip to the Pig Trail in NE Arkansas at the end of May, so that’ll be a great chance to see how it does on a mountain road. Don’t exactly have those here in Kansas.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Mike
03/26/2019 at 09:46

His mustang had a license plate that read “Camero” to poke fun at the number of craigslist postings that misspell camaro.

Nibby > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles
03/26/2019 at 09:47

Kinja'd!!!

Jayhawk Jake > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com
03/26/2019 at 09:47

I was actually really worried that the FR-S would reveal I’m not as good at autocross as I seemed. After the weekend it seems I’m pretty decent, but new tires will show where I really sit.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 09:50

T hanks for the review, it’s always great hearing personal, unbiased opinions about cars. It’s also great to hear your rationale. I really liked the quote:

But now that I’ve had real power I didn’t feel burdened by the desire for it.

That’s a great quote. As someone who used to ride a liter bike, I feel the same way. I’ve been to the mountain top, I’ve attained speed nirvana, so there’s no sense in pursuing that which is already completed. (For the street/casual use anyways, I would feel differently if I were a pro racer).

Your review is also timely because I’m in a bit of a dilemma at the moment. I’m starting to look for a new car and unsure of what I want. I crossed the Toyobaru off my list early but I may need to come back to it and reconsider.

Tripper > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 10:05

“When we put aside our biases and assumptions we open ourselves the new experiences and opportunities.”

Agree! For over a decade I Identified only with the highest sport trim of small German cars. A few months after I sold the S3 that I bought new, my dream 02 popped up and I bought it.

It’s definitely the oldest at 44 years, and probably the least powerful car I have ever owned but it’s already my favorite. Everything about it is so simple. Driving it I feel more connected than I ever have. Just like your FR-S, the lack of power is made up for by a lack of weight. At just a touch over 2000 lbs, it feels like a go kart with a body on it. It pretty much is, tiny wheels, no power steering etc...

My best friend had a BRZ and I loved it, he also auto x’ed it and eventually strapped on a supercharger and did a bunch of suspension work. Honestly I was fine with it the way it was from the factory. The extra power was fun, but rowdy. The suspension was so hard it was kind of awful to drive outside of a track.

Anyway great choice and way to expand your horizons!

WRXforScience > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 10:30

The Primacy tires are pure garbage and about 2s slower than RE71r’s on a 40ish second autox.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 10:39

That’s valid concern. Horsepower has a way of hiding all kinds of sins on a racetrack (at least until everyone else you’ re racing against also has it). Pedaling cars that don’t have much is where you find out how fast you really are.

HondoyotaE38: A Japanese and German Collab...wait a minute > Mike
03/26/2019 at 11:00

r/woosh

Keylube > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 11:15

I’ve run a similar course , trading a 2013 Scion FRS modded for track use in place of a 2017 GT350. Should be interested to see how you like it.

Michael Gossett > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 11:58

The torque dip can be corrected with headers and a tune. And it’ll give her a little more kick.

I love my 86, it's the most fun car I've ever had. (Even over a 1st gen miata)

Jayhawk Jake > Mike
03/26/2019 at 12:16

I mean, it would have become very clear very quickly that I was talking about a Mustang....

Jayhawk Jake > WRXforScience
03/26/2019 at 12:17

Currently only the fronts are Primacy, the rear are some cheap Nexens. So probably still accurate.

Distraxi's idea of perfection is a Jagroen > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 14:43

I did a similar thing, moving down from a 430hp ex Group A Commodore race car down to a GT86 track toy. The 86 puts down lap times that are literally 40% slower than the commodore, but it’s honestly much more fun.

And soooooo much cheaper to run. The Conmodore was avgas, 2 gallons of synthetic oil every 3rd use, and nonstop repairs (1 engine, 3 gearboxes and I dunno how many diffs in 5 years), whereas the 86 I just fill her with gas and play. I only recently bothered even replacing the OE tires - they’re slow, but they’re nice and progressive, and they last like you wouldn’t believe.

My first impression, which hasn’t changed much a few years later, is here: https://oppositelock.kinja.com/2013-toyota-gt86-the-driving-it-home-review-1787580223

Wrong Wheel Drive (41%) > Jayhawk Jake
03/26/2019 at 15:31

Sounds exactly how I’d describe my experience with the three different FRS/BRZ that I have rented from Turo. Definitely has the true spirit of a Miata in coupe form. They are still a bit pricey for my needs at the moment but I would definitely replace my broken miata with one if the funds/timing was right right now.

Jfrench2 > Jayhawk Jake
03/27/2019 at 07:56

Don’t let them get to you. I enjoyed the article. I have a Toyota 86 and feel the same way you do about the future of this car. Thanks for the good read...

B_dol > Jayhawk Jake
03/29/2019 at 10:44

Congrats! The FRS/BRZ is just such an eager car, super fun to hammer through the gears and attack turns and very easy on the budget.